Norman Allan
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Water as Fuel technology, as I understand it (which I don't)


There is more than one process out there being talked about :~

"Brown's gas" is an electrolysis product, but it is rather special...

The "Joe cell" is not electrolysis, but a deeper, stranger magic. It is primed electrically but then runs, just runs


"Brown's gas": Hydrogen and Oxygen from electrolysed water has many remarkable properties:

~ it implodes! (It does not explode)

~ it burns as a remarkable flame
   ~  it burns to water, only water
       (no pollutant: it burns into clean water,
       clean water is its only by product.)

   ~ the flame in itself is not hot, but
      it heats tungsten to gas (thousands of degrees)
      it doesn't heat water(? I think.)
      it heats stone to incandesent
      and even vapourizes stone (what comes off?)
      it can weld metal to stone (?) and ceramic

      it can drive cars
      heat houses
      cleanly greenly leaving water
      (cool ?)

But does the burning the electrolysed of water (2H2.O2) (?) create energy?
Big Dee says, "Wait and see."

Amongst the top Google sites for

Brown's Gas Knudtson's paper

Dee says the reaction proceeds with very little energy input through the mediation of catalysts...

Dee has got hold of a stainless steel canister for his cell
but finds drilling the steel cups he'd bought for the electrode
did not work oops

(the puck to bed the electrode in, I thought clever)

welding with Browns gas is astounding

Nothing that is until unique results became evident in the way materials
reacted to the flame. The first thing that is readily evident is that the
flame has no radiant heat. To place your hand near the flame you only
feel a slight warmth. Come into contact with the flame and you are
quickly burned. Additional work pointed to the fact that many lighter
materials such as Aluminum, have minor reactions to heating under the gas.
Dense materials like stones, bricks, or concrete became instantaneously
white hot. Melting very quickly when subjected to the flame. In later
years, Thermographic testing if the flame would reveal that the flame
contains very little heat at all, scarcely approaching temperatures above
the boiling point of water. The most dramatic results were seen in the
exposure of Tungsten to the flame. It was immediately heated to a boiling
point issuing up its oxide. The sublimation point of Tungsten being about
5620 Deg. C.

The Joe cell:





Amongst the top Google sites for

Joe cell


Paul says "According to the description on it's ionized hydrogen
gas. But I expect the primary ion is (H2O)+.

I'm comparing this to vapour pressure, there should also be ions of
(H3O)+, (OH)+, H+ and H2+ in there. Extremely caustic I expect.

Interesting: what does that mean? That it is reducing and oxygenating stuff. It is potentially highly reactive, but not with water sols.

How often does it need water added?

Not often, I think. Water makes a lot of Brown/Rhodes' gas.


info, from

1962 - William A. Rhodes (USA) is the first inventor known to patent an electrolyzer that produced the simple 'single-ducted' gas we now call Brown's Gas .
1974 - Ten years after William Rhodes patents, Yull Brown (originally a Bulgarian Student named Ilya Velbov 1922-1998) from Australia filed a patent on his design of a Browns Gas electrolyzer and spent the rest of his life trying to make Brown's Gas a commercial success. He spent about 30 million dollars and nearly 30 years in this endeavor. Due to his lifelong effort, he is posthumously honored by continuing to call the gas Brown's Gas .Several companies were started, both in cooperation and in competition with Yull Brown. Due to his efforts this variety of hydrogen gas is called (Yull ) Brown's Gas.
THE DISCOVERY OF BROWN'S GAS Born in 1922 in Bulgaria, Yull Brown went to Australia in 1958 as an electrical engineer with a deep belief that Jules Verne’s vision of "There is fire in water", could be realized. He worked as an unknown laboratory technician until he could develop his own laboratory. By 1978 Professor Brown was being described by The Australian Post as "the most talked about inventor in Australia today". He discovered in the early 1970's a proprietary method of water electrolysis that yields a nonexplosive mixture of hydrogen and oxygen gas in the precise atom-to-atom ratio of two volumes of hydrogen to one volume of oxygen. Professor Yull Brown disco vered that hydrogen and oxygen gas can be safely mixed (plus or minus 5 percent) if that ration is strictly maintained. The result is Brown's Gas, a hydrogen and oxygen mixture that can be economically generated, compressed, and used safely. In Professor Brown's process, the hydrogen and oxygen gases are immediately and intimately mixed at exactly the right ratio (the scientific term is "stoichiometric mix"). Brown's Gas is produced within an electrolysis cell, without membranes and with safety, invented by Professor Brown.

Key Papers
Common Duct Electrolytic Oxy-Hydrogen - aka Brown's Gas, hydroxy, green gas, di-hydroxy, watergas. Updated paper by William A. Rhodes, Ph.D., inventor of Oxy-Hydrogen. Rhodes lays his claim as the inventor of the process.
Electrically Expanded Water - George Wiseman presents his theory for the unusual properties of what he calls Brown's Gas, replacing his former theory of monoatomic oxygen and hydrogen. Describes the formation of a plane of bubbles forming between the plates. "When the electricity (in the Brown's Gas) is released by the 'flame,' it comes out as electricity and the water 'implodes' to it's original liquid form, with no heat and no expansion first. That's also why the flame is 'cool' yet has high energy effects."

HYDROXY - Todd Knudtson, another stellar researcher and inventor, offers a scientific explanation of the gas behaviors.

Amongst the top Google sites for

Brown's Gas Knudtson's paper

Joe cell

" a solution of ordinary salt (sodium chloride, NaCl) in water,
the cathode reaction will be

2H2O + 2e- ? 2OH- + H2
and hydrogen gas will bubble up;

the anode reaction is

2H2O ? O2 + 4H+ + 4e-." wikipedea

oxygen bubbles up

the ions OH- and H+ stay in solution
indeed they are water H+.OH-